Gretchen Rubin is on Dear Nina to talk about friendship!
Welcome to Dear Nina, conversations about Friendship. I’m your host, Nina Badzin. I’ve been writing about friendship since 2014. I lead creative writing groups in Minneapolis, and I’ve been a huge fan of today’s guest since 2009 when The Happiness Project was first published. I cannot believe this, but I have author, speaker, podcaster, and thought leader, Gretchen Rubin, on the show today!
Gretchen was here to talk with me about her newest book, Life in Five Senses, and specifically about how awareness of the five senses can improve our friendships. We covered examples such as listening better for what’s being said and not being said, making plans to see new sights with friends, paying attention to where our eyes are focused (not on our phones and Apple watches), hugging friends (a challenge for me!), taste experiments, leaning into nostalgia through discussing memories of smells and tastes, the perfect sense experience of the mixtape, why my husband Bryan is a classic “upholder,” (a reference from The Four Tendencies), and so much more.
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Meet Gretchen Rubin
Gretchen Rubin is one of today’s most influential observers of happiness and human nature. She’s the author of many books, including the blockbuster New York Times bestsellers Outer Order, Inner Calm; The Four Tendencies; Better Than Before; and The Happiness Project. Her books have sold more than 3.5 million copies worldwide, in more than thirty languages. She hosts the top-ranking, award-winning podcast “Happier with Gretchen Rubin,” where she explores practical solutions for living a happier life. Raised in Kansas City, she lives in New York City with her husband and two daughters. You can find everything you need at gretchenrubin.com.
Topics We Covered:
- The importance of understanding how other people’s preferences helps us to be understanding and compassionate friends.
- The five senses with specific examples of how tuning into each one has potential for improved connections with everyone we love or with anyone we want to know better.
- We spent a lot of time on sound, probably because it’s my most heightened sense. I have strong feelings about sound, including listening to what is being said and what is not being said.
- We spent the second most amount of time on touch, my most neglected sense. Yes, my issues with hugging came up again. You can take Gretchen’s neglected sense quiz on gretchenrubin.com/quiz.
- My favorite topic of phone distractions and Apple watch nonsense came up in the sight discussion.
- Using discussions of memories of tastes to ignite nostalgia with old friends or to learn more about new friends
- We had a fun tangent about The Four Tendencies when I got to tell Gretchen about my husband’s annual upholder gift to me. (I’m an obliger and he’s the upholder of all upholders.)
Highlights from my conversation with Gretchen:
Nina: “I see in all of your writing and in your podcast with you sister, Elizabeth, that you’re encouraging people to learn about themselves, but also to realize every one of us is different, so we should have more patience and more compassion for others.”
Gretchen and I both prefer making plans on email versus texts, but we will both bend to what the majority prefers.
Gretchen explained the visit to the eye doctor that inspired Life in Five Senses and how the news of her increased change for major vision issues made her appreciate her sight and all of her senses with a new passion.
From the book:
“My environment felt oversaturated and processed, but also virtual and flattened. I wanted to make direct contact.”
“Through my senses, I hope to find new ways to build connections with the people I loved.”
We covered each sense next!
Sound: We both cannot stand loud restaurants; we covered Gretchen’s new listening manifesto, which includes listening for what is not being said; Listen for someone bringing up the same topic again and again. They want to discuss it–don’t change the subject; Gretchen noted that listen and silent are the same letters rearranged–know when to be quiet; turning your body towards someone when listening; I brought up how mixtapes were the perfect combo of sound, sight, and touch.
Touch: We talked about my hugging issues. (I find them so awkward! Who starts the hug? Ah!) And I was not surprised to see that touch was my most neglected sense. You can take Gretchen’s neglected sense quiz here. We discussed ways to add the joy of touch into my life. I said I’d challenge myself to hug my friends more. And to go first!
Taste: I like cooking, but only for other people. That’s a way I connect through taste. Gretchen doesn’t love cooking or throwing a dinner party, but in the book (and in the episode), she talked about a really fun taste experiment she conducted with friends to challenge everyone to compare tastes of different apples, chips, and other items. It was a great way to bond and really talk without being overly intimate or revealing. After reading Gretchen’s book, my friend Rebekah Jacobs texted some college friends to ask them to list foods they ate in college and it made everyone happily nostalgic.
Smell: Both smell and taste are associated with memories. (Really taste, more so.) I remembered ho important buying perfume became in middle school. (Benetton Colors!) Smell is a category rarely discussed because often it could get brought up in a negative way. I learned about odor fatigue in this section!
Sight: We discussed Gretchen’s daily visits to The Metropolitan Museum of Art and how sometimes bringing a friend brought new memories of that friend any time Gretchen went back there. We talked about the human brain’s ability to recognize faces and what seeing expressions on faces instantly tells us about how people are feeling. We spent a while on the sight of people’s phones and how distracting it is for everyone around that one phone.
The Four Tendencies
We had a tangent about a special birthday tradition Bryan and I have for my birthday that combines his “upholder” tendency with my “obliger” tendency.”
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2 Responses
I really enjoyed this episode and especially your story about going out with Brian in your birthday so he could help you with your goals. From one obliger and Capricorn to another this a great story.
Aww I love that we’re Capricorns and obligers buddies!