[00:00:00] Nina: I’m not saying to be fake to her as in going out of your way to be super nice. I just wouldn’t go out of your way anymore to be not nice, which it kind of feels like is what you’re doing, which I get.
Welcome to Dear Nina, Conversations About Friendship. You have landed on a new series for Dear Nina, and that is the letter spotlight. I’ve done a previous episode where I did about five letters in one, which was kind of a lot. I have put some of the letters I get into other episodes, especially more at the beginning, about three years ago, when I started the podcast, I often had the episode be about one of the letters and I would bring on a guest and over time I transitioned out of that because there were so many topics I wanted to cover that didn’t necessarily relate to a specific letter and I didn’t want to keep the letters as part of every episode, which is why I moved the letters to my newsletter, which is at DearNina.substack.com
And I do still about every six weeks put a letter on there. That is for paying subscribers. All the other newsletters are free, but the Letters that are behind a paywall are the only and I mean the only way I monetize this podcast. So if you have been enjoying this podcast and you’re looking for a way to say Thank you and just show a little nod of hey, I really like the work you’re doing.
I enjoy listening to the podcast I enjoy the newsletter being a paying subscriber to the newsletter is one way. Another way is just to leave me five stars or a review on Apple. Don’t think Spotify lets you write reviews. You can only write a review on Apple. And those really mean a lot to me. I love knowing how episodes have helped you with your friendships or made you think about things differently. So that’s just two ways to support my work.
Today’s letter spotlight is going to be a new model. Like I was saying that we do on the show here, which is where I take one, letter that represents other letters. So that’s a perfect example for today’s letter, which is about sisters in law.
I’ve written once before about sisters in law. I’m very lucky to have a really wonderful relationship with my three sisters in law. I, hit the jackpot. I am lucky that when I read this letter, I don’t have this issue, but understanding a lot of elements of friendship, I could still bring something to this letter writer, who is really suffering with her relationship with her sister in law. And I normally do not touch family on this podcast because I do think family is different. But a sister in law is different than your sister, your brother, somebody that you grew up with, who you share parents with.
This is somebody who came into your life, not by your choice but because somebody you love love, your sibling, brought this person into your life. So it’s complicated. I mean frankly you could argue siblings are the same, because you also didn’t choose them and there’s some truth to that. But again, if I start in with family stuff I get a lot of pitches about that. People with novels write to me about, There’s sisters in my book and will you feature my book because there’s sisters in it and sisters are like friends and I really say I don’t do family, which I generally don’t, but we’re going to do this sister in law one. Are you ready for the letter? I’m ready to read it to you.
Dear Nina, I’ve been married for 19 years. The family I’m married into is a large, nice family, but I’ve never felt like I fit in. When my sister in law came along a couple of years after me, I was excited because I thought we could be good friends.
She lives out of state. We see each other at least five times a year when they come to visit. We have kids the same age that want to be together every second of the day when they come to visit. So I’m pausing here to say, it’s really nice that the cousins are close, like that’s a beautiful thing. Okay.
Back to the letter. She’s always been hard to read, polite, but guarded, and sometimes rude. Here’s just one example multiplied by hundreds of similar examples. I was visiting her home, and we were talking about nothing consequential, and then without saying a word, she got up off the couch, went upstairs, and sat on the couch in the room where her husband was hanging out.
I’ve gone back and forth over the years, giving her the benefit of the doubt, or thinking her cold behavior was intentional. The last few years though, I thought I had made headway, and that we were sort of friends. Well, then I had an epiphany. We went on a family vacation with the entire extended family, and it became very obvious that she couldn’t have cared less to spend any time together on this vacation. I was making all the effort, and I gave up halfway through. The remaining few days, she literally never acknowledged me, And didn’t even say goodbye when we left. This was a year ago, and the behavior has continued. I will say my reaction to it has been petty because it stung so bad. I’ve handed out my fair share of passive aggressive silent treatment in the time since. Every time they visit, it sends me into a bout of depression because it brings up the feelings of rejection and shame.
Okay, I’m pausing here. Sorry for the pause, but I just want to say so I don’t forget to Bring it up I admire this self awareness and this letter writer. So I’m gonna just read that part again She says I’ve handed out my fair share of passive aggressive silent treatment in the time since. Every time they visit it sends me into a bout of depression because it brings up feelings of rejection and shame. So this letter writer is aware that her feeling of rejection and shame is causing her to behave a certain way, which now we might be in like a cycle here of chicken egg, according to her sister in law, right? Like if you were to ask her sister in law, she might say, well, My sister in law always acts pouty around me.
It’s so tiresome, like why do I want to be around someone who’s pouty? whereas the person writing the letter is telling us she’s acting pouty because of the way she’s been treated. So things can get really mixed up like that. Okay, back to the letter. The letter writer says, if it weren’t for my kids wanting to see their cousins all the time I would just avoid them when they were here, but I feel forced to see them for the sake of my kids. I have stopped expecting we are going to be friends, but I feel so hurt and left out whenever I see them. It’s causing a lot of marital problems, too. My husband can sort of see what I’m talking about, . But he is very loyal to his brother.
So a lot of the time he downplays how they have treated me and tells me I just need to suck it up and be friendly to them. But I’m tired of trying any good advice on how to see the situation differently can you see why I took this letter? It is. Really relatable to a lot of people. I know it is. Actually such an interesting thing being someone who receives a lot of anonymous letters because I can see patterns.
Now, of course, it’s a certain kind of person who listens to my show, who gets my newsletter, who knows where to even find the anonymous form on my website, which I really try to make easy to find. It’s in every show notes. If you ever go to my website, dearninafriendship.com. It’s a dearninapodcast.com. I have a lot of URLs that lead to the same place. Ninabadzin.com. At the top, it says, write me an anonymous letter or every episode’s show notes, whether you’re an Apple, Spotify, anywhere you’re looking on my episodes in the show notes at the bottom, it will have the link to write me an anonymous letter.
For whatever reason, the subset of people who listen to my show, read my newsletters, There are definitely a lot of problems with sisters in law. This was just the best written, most articulate version of it. I get what she’s saying about you know somebody isn’t interested in you or you assume they aren’t.
I think this sounds like a fair assumption. I can only take this letter writer at her word, but it does feel like the sister in law just wants to be sisters in law and does not want to be friends. I think she’s not imagining things based on what she has described. That is a yucky feeling, right?
When you want something out of somebody, you want a certain connection with someone and that person is making it clear that they’re not interested. For sure in my twenties, when I was first making friends in town, if somebody wasn’t that interested, I took it very personally and probably for the next 15 years was a little cold when I would run into them.
Yeah. I’m kind of embarrassed now for that behavior, but it’s very possible that those people now have a view of me of, that I’m kind of petty and cold and whatever, but I was acting out of really shame. I was acting out of shame and embarrassment that those people weren’t interested in being my friend at the time. Now I I’ve grown and I can’t really take that back. So if I can give a quick piece of advice is I would do what you can to stop the sort of petty shame cycle, because you only end up feeling bad later about acting that way, and then it’s not that you can’t apologize, but it might be kind of an unnecessary scene.
I’m not going to call up some of the people I have in mind and be like, you know how I was really unfriendly that time at the pool when I ran into you. That’s because 10 years earlier, uh, you were really clear about not wanting to be friends. I’m not digging that all up. I just have to live with the fact that I didn’t act my best self, that I went down to somebody else’s standard of not being that friendly by being not friendly, instead of just treating everybody well.
That is how I want to be in the world. I want to treat everybody well. That doesn’t mean going way out of my way for somebody who is clearly not interested in me, who is not ever made, room for me in their life. I’m not going to be a doormat, but there is a wide universe between being a doormat and walking around like with a chip on your shoulder.
You can exist in that world in between where you’re just your pleasant self if that’s how you are. If you’re not pleasant ever, then that’s not you. But if you’re someone who generally is good to people, nice to your friends, tries to be, you know, friendly enough, you don’t always have your nose in your phone every two seconds. I would advise being that way in the world, no matter who you’re with.
I have definitely felt rejected by people, who hasn’t, and instead of assuming the best meaning, you can still think what you want about the other person, but assuming that it’s not a horrible thing about you personally Maybe it’s a terrible time in their life. I know I’ve also been on that side of it where I have not been as interested in a friendship as somebody who is clearly interested in having one with me I’m just at that moment at capacity. Sometimes you just can’t accommodate everybody. By trying to accommodate everybody, you end up being kind of a bad friend to everybody. So I’ve grown on that in my life for sure. Now, like I’m saying, you don’t have to go out of your way for your sister in law who is not that interested in your relationship. I do wonder if you were acting more of your natural self, the self that you brought forth when she first came into the family, maybe a little dialed back from that, so not trying to be best friends, but not, acting hurt.
When we walk around the world with our hurt self, as the forward facing self, that’s not an easy person to be around. This is something I talked to my kids about when they were little. I remember one of my kids in particular would kind of pout on the playground with the hope that the other kids would realize that, I’m just going to say she, cause it is, I have four kids, two are girls, two are boys.
So, you’ll know as one of my daughters. she would pout and then she would come home and tell me like, Oh, I didn’t play with anyone today. I was upset at so and so. So I just sort of sat off to the side and I would tell her, maybe you as a parent might disagree with this advice, but I would Suggest against that. It’s, kind of delusional to think that, oh, if I just look sad enough and sit off to the side long enough, people will realize I’m upset and then they will go out of their way to be my friend. Really, the opposite happens. It’s just human nature. I even see it, um, Really with a teens.
Sometimes it’s very clear that one kid is not fitting in and one, or one kid feels left out. And then that kid sits on their phone the whole time in the corner. It seems like with the hope that, Oh, everyone will realize they’re leaving me out, but no, now you’ve made yourself unapproachable. This idea that if you are withdrawn enough and if you just make it clear enough that you’re not interested in you make yourself look sad and withdrawn that people will come to you. And I do think it kind of repels people more than it attracts people when you act that way.
I think it’s best to come to these family functions with your best self and talk to the people who are friendly to you. Talk to your nieces and nephews. Be a fun aunt. You’ll be there not to be your sister in law’s friend, be your sister’s in law’s sister in law instead of trying to be her friend.
I do think there is a special relationship out in the world, many of them, that once they get confused for friendship, problems happen. I would put in laws in that category, sisters in law and brothers in law, roommates, cousins, neighbors. Those are relationships that are their own special thing. Being a neighbor is its own special thing, and it doesn’t mean you have to be deep friends.
Now, some neighbors do become friends because as I already talked about earlier, proximity is a major factor in friendship. So if you really get along well with your neighbors and they live right there, you probably are going to see them more. You may really last minute say to your neighbor, Hey, let’s go for a walk or you’re already on a walk.
They’re already on a walk. So you decide to walk together. Um, you can’t do that with someone who’s not right in your neighborhood. you may do a happy hour or something like that together in a really spontaneous way. that’s where neighbors can become friends, but you also could just be great neighbors who help take in each other’s garbage cans when you’re on vacation or grab the mail. That’s its own wonderful thing.
Roommates, also, college roommate thing that has gotten so out of control with everyone thinking they’re going to be best friends with their roommate. When roommates were just roommates and there wasn’t this expectation that you have all these things in common and therefore you’re going to be friends. If you don’t know if you don’t have kids in this college season of life a lot of kids now are finding their roommates ahead of time on Instagram or some other way like through other friends and how are those matches getting made?
They’re saying oh, I like this music I like to do this kind of activity. I’m from this part of town. I have this background, therefore we should be roommates because we might be friends. As opposed to accepting roommates are just roommates and you might not be friends, but getting along with your roommate is its own good thing to have in life.
People who are considerate of each other, who aren’t noisy when your roommate’s trying to study, who don’t have dirty laundry strewn about. Just being a respectful roommate is a great relationship and you don’t have to be friends to have a pleasant roommate. So, too, can sisters in law and brothers in law exist in the same family for the common goal of holidays and closeness and kids being, cousins with each other and having a positive cousin relationship, which also is its own special thing and doesn’t have to be best friends.
I think trying to be close friends in these categories does muddy the relationship a little bit. We have space from our friends and choice in our friendships in a way we don’t have with our family. And a sister in law is a family member. So her last line here of any good advice on how to see the situation differently. I guess that’s what I’m speaking to here is: See your sister in law as a family member and not as friend potential. And I know that train has kind of already left the station, but I think you can back it up a bit and I would immediately stop acting hurt and rejected.
I’m not saying you don’t have the right to feel that you have been rejected, but I would stop acting rejected and stop acting like you’re the outsider. Instead of saying to yourself, I’m the outsider, I’m the rejected sister in law, say to yourself: I am supportive to my husband who does want to maintain a relationship with his family.
I’m a wonderful aunt to these children. I don’t know how many there are but I’m just gonna say nieces and nephews. Instead of focusing on being a friend to your sister in law, there’s also focusing on being a sister in law to your brother in law, what that relationship might be like.
And I don’t know if you have a brother or not, but maybe it’s kind of neat to have a brother in law if you don’t have a brother. I normally do like a direct conversation. I’m a little nervous on a direct conversation in this case, because I’m not exactly sure, where it’s going if you have one. The objective here is to have pleasant family interactions.
I’m not saying to be fake to her as in going out of your way to be super nice. I just wouldn’t go out of your way anymore to be not nice, which it kind of feels like is what you’re doing, which I get. Totally normal human reaction to feeling rejected as I already explained at length, I one hundred percent did that in town and I am wishing I hadn’t. So I’m trying to help you stop doing that. I do think it’s fair to say to your husband and this is not a marriage podcast but I think you can say to your husband that you understand that the family relationship is really important and that you are also his family now and you would just like to know that he’s not going to allow you to be mistreated.
I think maybe that’s the person that you need to hear that from. Your sister in law cannot promise you that. Your brother in law cannot promise you that. The only person who really needs to be in your corner and have your back, number one, is your husband. I think it is absolutely fair for you to demand that and for you to give it in return. Just like in your family, you wouldn’t allow anybody to be outright rude to him. And by the way, you could also bow out sometimes.
You can allow the kids to get together and your husband to be with his family. And sometimes you might be busy five times a year, five visits. That’s a lot. I think it’s okay for you , maybe two of those five visits, you’re busy. And you’re not busy in a petty way. Maybe you’re leaving behind a cute gift for your niece and nephews. You can do something giving and generous of spirit and also be like, I have a, uh, readers retreat this weekend.
I don’t know why I said readers, but I know not everyone’s a writer. You really are a good writer though. That was a really well written letter. So maybe you have a writer’s retreat that weekend. So that’s like another way. It’s kind of a third way to be pleasant from afar. I wouldn’t avoid every get together.
Cause I think, that’s a recipe for disaster. You are going to have to be together sometimes. So it’s good to practice being together. Still, you don’t have to be at everything. I am sure that I did not cover this every which way I could. I am sure some people will disagree with my take. I’d love to hear any of it.
If you are struggling with your sister in law relationship, just know that I’m going to have this episode up in the Facebook group after it goes out, and I’m certain there will be discussion under it. If you’re the one who wrote this letter and you’re hearing this, I hope this was helpful in some way.
And I do feel for you, because it does not feel good to feel rejected anywhere out in the world and certainly within your own family. So I’m sorry you’ve been going through this thank you for sharing, because I do think it will help other people. All right, listeners, if you have a letter for me, you know where to find me.I already explained many ways in this episode. Come back next week when our friendships are going well. We are happier all around. Bye.
