00:00:00] Nina: Welcome to another episode of dear Nina conversations about friendship today, we’re tackling two topics with one topic, logically leading to the other. Number one is how to go from being casual acquaintances to actually considering someone, a friend, and number two, how to make it easier to have people over for a meal.

Those two are intricate connected, even though it might not seem like it. I. The only sensible guest to handle this C. And that is my very good friend, Deborah Arbi, who is sitting right here in my newly outfitted little office with a brand new second microphone. In addition to being a consultant for women business owners and raising three young kids, Deborah has hosted.

Tons of friends and acquaintances and family at her house for meals over the past handful of years, pre COVID. And then at some point when it became clear that she would not be able to have people over, like she used to, she took her love for cooking onto her Instagram account. For the love of cookbooks.

I’m gonna tell you the name of that. Again, it’s at, for the love of cookbooks, where she takes her longtime passion for cooking her way through entire cookbooks and does much of it live on her stories. It is a fabulous account. I urge everyone to follow it. The welcome Deborah.

[00:01:20] Debra: Thanks, Nina. It’s so fun to be.

Like the first official guest live and in person in the Nina

[00:01:26] Nina: studio. Yeah. So if you wanna be on the show and you live in Minneapolis and you’re not scared to sit, you know, probably less than a six feet from me, maybe we’re six feet, then I welcome you to my home studio. All right, Debra, before we get to everything, you’re gonna be able to tell us about having people over and having it not be stressful or at least less stressful.

I wanna talk about the first thing I mentioned in the intro, which is taking a friendship to the next level. Cause we did that really well. I’d say we are a major success story and it was not that long ago. I mean, do we even know how long three years, four years? How long have we been friends?

[00:02:00] Debra: Yeah, I think it’s been about four.

I do always say that you’re one of my. If not my absolute, newest, closest friend, like of my close friends, you’re definitely the newest, only four years in. So yeah, that’s pretty.

[00:02:14] Nina: That is on the new assignment. Debra grew up in Minneapolis, like you’ve been here your whole life and I’ve been here 20 years.

It’s like, I’m, I’m hardly a newcomer anymore. I’ve been here. I always say my entire adult life. So it is a success story of making a new close. Well into the adult years, which I get a lot of questions about that. People meet each other. We’re a great example of that. It’s like we met and it’s not like people don’t meet other people, but how do you get to that next level?

And Deborah, I’m gonna have you tell our friendship

[00:02:40] Debra: story. Let’s see here. So it was probably now about five years ago that I started working at our co-working space, modern well, and. Nina. And I both worked there and we just kind of started seeing each other there all the time. And so you see a lot of people at co-working spaces, so it’s easy to just kind of wave and say hi, but there was something about the two of us that it was, it was actually genuinely a problem that like, we could not stop talking.

Once we got started, there would be days when one of us would walk in and it was like, you can’t even sit by me.

[00:03:12] Nina: And we were really just getting to know each other. Now I should say we knew of each other. It’s not like you were a total stranger, but I mean, I don’t think we’d ever had a conversation at all.

I don’t even know if we would’ve recognized each other. Well, maybe we would have, I know your siblings and we just, we know other people in common, but I do remember those early times at modern. Well, exactly. I remember having to, you’d have to sit on one side of the building and I’d have to go to another because we.

Get anything done. We couldn’t control

[00:03:37] Debra: ourselves in that way. It was a very natural friendship from the beginning, but it also, would’ve been so easy to leave it at that because we had known of each other. We are a very small handful of years apart, but it felt significant cuz your kids are older than that five years apart.

We four years apart. So I

[00:03:52] Nina: think four, yeah, I’m older. We should establi that. Yeah. In this should establish that. yeah. And this speaks to something I talked about in episode 20 about. Friendship chemistry, which is we had immediate chemistry, but chemistry does not always translate into a friendship.

Something has to happen between chemistry. And now we have more to do with each other’s lives than just saying hi at

[00:04:11] Debra: Maah and, and thus leads us to the big moment which was, I, well remember it, it was like a super sunny day. I still remember it. And. I had just eaten lunch at modern. Well, I knew Nina was coming in in the afternoon.

I think you were teaching a class and I was there working and I had just eaten lunch and I have a problem that I cannot finish a meal without eating something sweet. Um, like I need a piece of chocolate at the end of every meal and there was. Not a single shred of chocolate at modern, well that day. And so I picked up my phone and I texted Nina.

I had never really done that. I think I had your number from an email and I was like, are you ready to take our friendship to the next level? that is literally I think the words I said, and then I said, what do you have in the way of. Sweet chocolate things in your house. And will you please bring me some, because this is an absolute state of emergency and she immediately responded and, um, and you, you can tell me, but you, she was like, yes, I have a whole stash of Halloween candy or something.

You had a bunch of kid candy and yep. You were like, I will be there within a half hour. And it sounds so silly, but. Kind of taking it off of just seeing each other at modern well, and into the texting world and into the favor world. Yes, that’s right. Is really what

[00:05:27] Nina: cracked it open. I was gonna say that about favors.

Like when you ask someone for a favor that is a big step in a friendship, but this is of course an extremely small favor, but you could ask for bigger favors and it does. Move things along. And like you said, about the text stream. Now we had a conversation going, and once you start in a text with somebody, that’s a place to keep dipping into a conversation.

We text all the time, right? Yeah. We text, we, I introduced Deborah. I think I introduced you to the voice memo. Yes. I love a voice memo. We talk, we actually speak on the phone. We walk, we go out to lunch. Like we, we do all the things,

[00:05:58] Debra: right. It’s all all started with that. I think you’ve told me this Nina that I don’t know if it was something you read or something like that.

But I think about it a lot that when you. When a person asks another person for a favor, the person who has been asked. Of the favor, like you in this situation actually feels closer to the Oscar than the other way around. You would think. I think logically that doesn’t seem right, but it really does make a lot of sense.

And so, you know, asking someone for a favor is also sort of like giving them an invite to being a closer friend. And it’s such a lovely way to start now.

[00:06:31] Nina: I often. That if you are somebody who is waiting for others to reach out or waiting for others, to invite you places, you may be waiting a long time. So I’m switching us now from becoming friends, just you and I in our personal story, just, I loved that example to a broader idea of having people over at your house for meals.

It could be brunch, it could be lunch, it could be dinner, it could be whole families. It could be just a friend for coffee, but this idea of inviting someone into your house and. Taking the initiative is so important. If you want to have plans, you have to make plans. So I wanna talk about your experience of having people over and tell us a little bit about your story with that.

Cuz there’s a story there too. You didn’t just like one day randomly start inviting people. There was actually some rhyme and reason to it.

[00:07:20] Debra: Yep. So it was actually a new year’s resolution. I think it was 2017. It may have been 2016. I think it was one of those years. I made a new year’s resolution that for a calendar year, we would have 40 Friday night dinners in our home with 40 different families.

And I would be making 40 brand new, never. Before made recipes from a cookbook. So it was sort of three part goal. It was so fun. We were at a life stage when we had three really little kids. So I think I had a three, two year, three year old, a two year old and a baby. And so going out to eat was like so hard it was just like next to impossible.

There was someone bedtime, someone diapers. It was just not happening, but I missed seeing people. So I decided. To bring ’em into my house. So that was how it started. And now it’s become borderline. We could call it a passion. We can call it an obsession, however you wanna call it. But I absolutely love, love opening my home to people.

And how would you decide who to have over? Good question. First of all, it was a while ago, but, so, I mean, we started with our, our friends right. Yeah. But we don’t have 40. Very close friends, you know? Um, I don’t think most people do. So we started with those people to kind of just get going and then what’s nice about, and I don’t expect most people will have this, but what was nice about this goal was it was a nice kind of icebreaker to say to someone that was more of a, maybe more than an acquaintance, but less than a really good friend to be able to say, Hey, we’ve made this our goal.

Would you ever wanna come over on some Friday? What Friday night might you be open to it? And then it does it sort of like cuts down the awkwardness. And so I guess, I don’t know if we’re at the advice portion of the program here yet, but it’s always the advice portion. Okay. is that while I don’t think most people will say I made it my goal to have 40 Friday night dinners.

I do think that saying something like. We’ve been trying to host more at our house. We’re a little new to this. Would you want to be a part of that? You know, I, I think that it’s just people, again, you’re sort of almost asking them a favor at that point to be like, will you help me by coming?

[00:09:22] Nina: Or even like in a post COVID world, you could say, I really miss people happen over, or I, I meant to be inviting people over and then COVID happened and I’m gonna get back to that.

I like that.

[00:09:31] Debra: Yeah. So yeah, I mean, we didn’t like plan way, way far in advance. It was like when new people would come into our lives for all different reasons, we’d be like, Hey, or people we hadn’t seen in a long time, or even coworkers who sometimes it can be awkward to be like, am I gonna have this coworker over?

But it’s sort of a nice way to do it. Children are like the ultimate diffuser, cuz everyone’s just looking down at their kids and it’s not as awkward when they’re all

[00:09:53] Nina: around. And now I wanna mention. Hosting really, some people love it. Some people don’t. I put on my Facebook group, dear Nina, the group, which is a private group that anyone can join love to have you.

And sometimes I’ll put the topic out early so that we could add those comments to the episode. And it usually adds something I wouldn’t have thought of. No surprise. I got some people who were like, I love hosting. And some people were like, Ugh, that’s so stressful. So I wanna share some of the positive just to reiterate some of the stuff, Deborah and I are both saying about how much potential there is when you have people over.

And this was a great comment. One of the members said I’m a big fan of hosting. I think there is magic in having friends in your sacred space, sharing time and stories over a. That you made that lingering time after the meal is done. Laughs tea, your coffee, all special moments with no pressure giving up your table at a restaurant freedom to see where the night takes you in an intimate time and space.

And someone else said, I love sharing food and stories. It’s easier to listen to people in a quiet environment. Another person said it can be fun. To mix up friends and decide who would make a good combo. Finally, someone said, I love hosting friends for meals, Shabbat, Jewish holidays, Thanksgiving. We always have a crowd.

I like cooking a baking. It’s a chance to socialize with friends and have our kids connect with our friends’ kids, et cetera. So that’s all really positive.

[00:11:08] Debra: It’s the chills from some of those comments? I think, nice. This is obviously a passion of mine, so I’m like, that’s all so true.

[00:11:14] Nina: And that really speaks, like I said to the potential and I personally love.

Being a guest and hosting. Now it is not without its stresses. And we’ll talk about that too, but I hate sitting in the same spot all night long in a restaurant. And I also, the older I get, I find it hard to hear, like one of these commenters spoke to that really is a real thing. I mean, you I’m really struggling to hear sometimes with all the background noise and then you’re in one spot and I have been known to say that.

Any number of people at a restaurant over six people is not a fun night out, right? That is two separate events that are happening at that table. Once you get to eight people. And then of course, if you’re gonna have kids in the picture with all that, you’re immediately at a big number, right. I wanna share a couple of the comments about the challenges of hosting, cause that’s really what we’re gonna spend the rest of our episode on is how to overcome those challenges.

And those were, I love hosting. I find it stressful, wanting the house to be clean the food to be good. And the experience to be fun. I feel like I’m a good hostess, but it’s not effortless for me. Someone else said I love to host, but I also get stressed out about it. So I don’t do it as often as I would like to someone else said, can you give us some tips to make it easier?

And isn’t that the perfect segue. So Deborah who has done this so many times is going to. Give us some tips and I’ll give some of mind too or agree, whatever, probably most likely.

[00:12:30] Debra: Yeah. So I have definitely learned a lot along the way, which is probably my first tip actually, which is like any other thing, literally.

Any other thing you do is it’s mostly just about practicing. There was a time when I absolutely it. There was more thought about it. It was maybe harder. I, I barely remember that time now and now it’s just because it’s so part of our family and our kind of family’s rhythm is that it just it’s become so much easier.

and so there is nothing to it, but to do it really. And so that’s my number one piece of advice is if you wanted to get easier, you just have to do it more and

[00:13:07] Nina: maybe allow yourself to fail to, I served raw chicken. The first time I had people over it was Brian’s family chicken was raw. I don’t think I quite understood.

The difference between reading directions and cuz I did cook it for as long as the direction said, but you know, every Oven’s different chicken’s different sizes. And when it looked cooked on the outside, I mean, but I’ve learned more exactly what you’re saying practice. Now I would know if chicken was cooked even in the inside just looking at it.

Right.

[00:13:31] Debra: And I think too, a couple things, the more you do it, you still might mess up. It’s not like I’ve never burned the meal. But you take it a little bit less hard. Yeah. Like, oh, I burned today’s meal. Not like I’m the world’s worst hostess for me making brand new recipes weirdly takes the pressure off in some ways of the food, because I’m like, I don’t know if this is gonna be good.

You don’t know if this is gonna be good. We’re all part of an experiment here versus this is my. Absolute specialty. And then the, the guest is also like, oh my God, I better like it because, or show them that I like it. Or we’re just kind of like all experiencing the food yeah. At the same time. So that’s just something kind of fun about it is that there’s, there’s no like pressure to love the food or not love the food.

And also when it comes to hosting and. More. So when it comes to being a guest is when you put yourself in the guest’s shoes, you don’t walk into a house thinking like this better be good. And you’re mostly worried about like your own kid’s behavior, your own stuff. Like where am I supposed to

[00:14:29] Nina: be going?

You’re just happy not to put, not to

[00:14:31] Debra: feed anybody. What I was gonna say is that there is no reason to make it overly fancy. At all, just the wherever, your like, level of what would make you feel comfortable and happy doing do that. Yeah, truly. If I walked in and I said, if you invited me for Shabbat and it was Domino’s, I would be mostly, I’d be like, my kids are gonna be so happy.

So thank you. So yeah, it really is not that important. The actual meal is not that important. And then that also leads into the cleaning the house ahead of time. I mean, there is, I guess there’s some minimum level of accept, I guess you wouldn’t want someone to walk in and there’s just legitimately.

Garbage all over the floor. Again, I have read an article about this, that people are actually more comfortable in homes that look more like how their home looks. And so it’s okay if there is that, it looks like your house has been

[00:15:17] Nina: lived in. Yeah. People like live in this house. Exactly.

[00:15:19] Debra: It’s no secret that you live there and it’s no secret that maybe little people live there with you and it’s okay.

And the thing that really makes people uncomfortable is the apologizing about it. And so that’s something I have really tried to. A hundred percent. It’s like when they walk in, I do not say anything. What’s going on in my house, unless it’s like, watch out, you don’t wanna step on the sharp Legos because they really hurt

[00:15:43] Nina: when we do that, that’s we all need to stop apologizing so much in general.

I mean, I play tennis a lot. Now I hear women and including myself apologize every time the ball goes into the net or something, or someone hits that, I also play with men. Sometimes they never apologize. and God bless him.

[00:15:58] Debra: I’ve never actually thought about that. That when my, when people walk in, my husband has never once been like, I’m so sorry for the pile of papers on this island.

No, it would be so weird if he did. It’s like, sorry we live here. Yeah. exactly. Yeah. So yeah, I would just really, again, much like the pizza is fine. If your goal is to make people feel comfortable in your house and for you to lower your stress. It, luckily those things work in tandem, which is just lower, the expectation.

And now your stress is lowered and your guest is more comfortable. So it’s like a win-win yeah. Everyone

[00:16:29] Nina: wins. Yeah. Okay. So less stress about the food, less stress about in terms of like the type of food and the quality of it. Less stress about how the kitchen looks and the house looks what’s your next step.

So it’s

[00:16:39] Debra: funny. I think when you say next step, it’s actually almost a prestep, which is most people when you ask. Over for dinner, they will ask you what they can bring. And I think that you start thinking, oh, well, if I was a really good host this, I would say nothing. Just bring yourself and all of that.

But people really want to bring something much like the favor, right? Yes. Like back to the beginning of this episode is that if you want them to feel closer to you and feel comfortable, don’t make them walk in empty handed because it’s awkward for. For them

[00:17:07] Nina: or have to guess like, cuz they’re probably not gonna come empty hands.

Exactly. So now they have to spend time, like what does she need?

[00:17:11] Debra: What does she like? Right. And so giving people a job is very helpful. If you want a tactical thing that I have learned over the years, my favorite outsourcing job is dessert. The reason I like to give dessert is because first of all, it doesn’t need to coordinate with whatever I am making.

So they’re not walk in with fried rice, alongside my barbecue hamburger. like, you know, some like weird side with some, so they doesn’t need to go together. So that’s nice that it doesn’t have to be part of my meal. And the other great thing about dessert is it lets people choose their level. Of commitment to the, to the job.

So there have been people that we have had, we genuinely had a pastry chef to our house once and she made like the most amazing sole I’ve ever had. And we’ve also had people come no joke from the gas station, with a package of chips of Hawaii cookies and both our perfect. Yeah. My kids are thrilled. We are Tru.

Just as happy with either. And so it’s like a choose your own adventure of involvement. And I really like dessert. So if you are looking for an easy job to give and definitely that’s, my piece of advice is give people a job is dessert. And then even once they’re there, another thing that I have learned over the years is especially on the whole, like let’s build the friendship is I used to be they’re coming at.

Dinner will be ready at six. That is not how it works. and so it’s better if, whenever they come give it like a good 30 minutes until you’re actually eating, cuz it just takes a minute to settle in to the new house. Especially if there’s kids involved, they wanna like explore, do some playing all of that during that half hour again, they will likely ask, is there anything I can do to help let them help you, right?

Yes. I believe that so strongly. Yeah. And so, and it, some people are like, I don’t want them like cooking with me. That’s fine. Let them fill water glasses, let them put out napkins, silverware, setting the table is a great thing for a guest to help. So it’s just like they feel at home right away. And it does just give you a chance to kind of warm up.

It’s like the warm up act too, especially if you’re looking, which again is sort of the theme of this podcast is if it’s your best, best friend. Wonderful. You’ve probably had them over a million times, but if this is someone you’re looking to kind of build a friendship with yeah. Maybe take it to the next place, something we’re talking about here.

It’s a really nice time that you’re not just like staring at each other, like what’s new with you. Yeah. How’s work. You’re both kind of working alongside each other. Yeah. And it’s it just kind of, it’s more comfortable than when you do sit down. People

[00:19:34] Nina: are so relieved when you give them a job. Oh my God.

Yes. I mean, I. Slid over a cutting board before I’m be like, can you just cut this cucumber? Yes. And that, to me, I’m not making it up as a job. Like for some reason it, I didn’t get it done or something and they do it slowly. Yes there’s it’s so to do something to do. It’s so nice. Exactly it is. And I like that too.

I think that when I’m a guest and someone doesn’t let me help more on the other end of the meal. That’s like a more obvious place too, which is. Clearing plates and carrying things to the kitchen in my head. I’m like, well, when they come to me, they’re gonna be helping. So yeah. I wish they would let me do something.

Yes. Cause I have no problem. Grab anything. You can bring it to the kitchen. Yes. And I don’t like have people sit there doing the dishes. I just love everything in the kitchen, near the sink. Just to bring it in the vicinity of the sink. Yes. Is huge. Except the one thing Deborah and I have talked about this before.

We are both really strong. Like if we. We don’t agree on everything in the world, actually, but we agree on this, which is never where it

[00:20:28] Debra: counts. This is where it counts that we

[00:20:30] Nina: agree. never clear the cups clearing the cups is extremely rookie and impractical thing to do. And even if it’s just adults, it has nothing to do with kids or not kids.

If you have five people over and you clear those cups, Rest assured you are going to be making five cups of water yes. In the next hour, because people get thirsty. Yes. After the

[00:20:49] Debra: meal and yeah, totally kids do. Cuz they leave. Then they come back then they’re like, I’m thirsty again. And so yes, AB we leave.

We actually, I U I’m a big proponent of cleaning the kitchen that night. Like I don’t like coming down to a, a, a sink of dishes by any means. I will come down and there’s still sometimes glasses cuz I’m like that’s okay. Yes. That can wait until the last possible

[00:21:12] Nina: moment. So cause that’s a horrible use of dishwasher space or yes, if you’re using plastic, let’s say it’s just a terrible waste.

Yeah. It really is to clear all those cups and then make new ones, one another hosting tip this isn’t really about friendship it’s well, I guess it sort of is cuz if the whole point of hosting is making other people comfortable and connecting, I don’t like when there isn’t water from the get go, but once in a blue moon I’ll go somewhere for dinner and.

No water or even discussion of water, I’d be thrilled to fill the water for you. Yeah, I’ll get there. And there isn’t water. Nobody’s talking about water. Water’s never gonna be offered and I’m not, what am I gonna drink? What are my kids gonna drink? I’m looking at a full state of anxiety about the thirst that I’m gonna have.

That’s funny. I don’t wanna be rude and be like, Hey. Shouldn’t we have water . So just like have the water. Yes. And have the have water in your plan. Yes. In

[00:21:58] Debra: your meal plan. That’s a great friendship. Tip Nina. Thank you.

[00:22:02] Nina: wench. My thirst please. Yeah. Did we miss anything Debra? Because we will move to our better friendship goal of the week, as soon as I make sure we have all of our, how to make hosting easier.

I’m trying

[00:22:13] Debra: to think. I guess the one thing I like. Think about Nina said about the difference between going to a restaurant versus going to a home, which is, there’s more of kind of like a rhythm to the night, a little bit. And there’s sort of like phases. There’s like the pre meal and then the meal and then the after meal while I really try not to overthink any of it.

And I wouldn’t say I overthink this, but I do like to think about how we’re

[00:22:36] Nina: sitting. Oh, I’m so glad you brought

[00:22:38] Debra: that. Because I think that it is what allows conversations to happen and often how you do leave the meal. As that your friendship has moved forward in whatever level doesn’t mean you’ve walked out best friends, but may, maybe, but like that your friendship has moved forward into some degree is to think about who are people sitting by.

And so, especially if there’s multiple families, but even two families. I, I think that that’s something that’s worth thinking about. Yes. And I, I don’t put out name tags or anything like that, but I do try to kind of a little bit, or. So you’re not kind of like closed off and it’s harder. How, however you wanna make that happen.

[00:23:19] Nina: I mean, if I do a name thing, it’s nothing formal. If I have a lot of people like family for a big holiday, I do assign suits. And if it’s less people, I will say, okay, I want you there. I mean, I’m no problem saying that. And it’s because I have thought through with many years of practice, you know, I’m 45 years old.

I’ve been doing this a long time also. Really? It makes a huge difference. Yeah. I do not wanna be. Separate from the adults, like right. Brian and I do not wanna sit with our kids on the other side of the table. No, thank you. We live with those people. Yes. I see them all the time. Yes. And I don’t need to be with Brian necessarily.

I just wanna be with the adults. I’d rather, they. Be a little uncomfortable for 15 minutes. They’re all gonna sit silently probably. Right. Whether they’re sitting by you or not,

[00:24:00] Debra: and then they’re gonna leave the table. Yes. Far before the adults leave the table. And then it leaves like a very awkward holes yes.

Throughout the table. And so I always put the kids together and the grownups together. That’s

[00:24:10] Nina: another tip by the way. You and I have talked about before and we also both agree on is let the kids eat. For 45 seconds and get rid of ’em. Yes. Get rid of ’em as fast as

[00:24:17] Debra: you take yes. A hundred percent and as a, a little tip for, and if you guys are out there who are guests, I think sometimes my guests feel that they have this need to be like, no, you have to stay at the table.

And I’m like, no, really they can go release them, actually ask them to leave. Yeah, exactly. And so I think they are worrying about being rude and it’s like, you’re not, I do have one last thing I wanna say, cuz I think this is important. Something that is maybe like an occupational hazard of being what Nina has called me, like an expert host.

I have never called myself that until this very minute, but, um, and having the Instagram where I’m always posting my food and all of that is that people sometimes I think people get nervous about having to reciprocate. So I just wanna talk a little bit about the reciprocate really important. Yeah. Like the reciprocation piece.

Of hosting. And I just wanna say that if anyone either wants to host or any hosts out there, probably my absolute number, one thing would be to say, Do it without any expectation of reciprocation, because that just cannot be your

[00:25:17] Nina: goal. It took me a long time to learn that, but I could not

[00:25:20] Debra: agree more. Yeah.

And it has nothing to do with that. And the people get like real intimidated. You’re so good at this. And I’m not, for some reason there’s something about cooking that makes people play the comparison game a lot because everyone has to cook to some degree in their lives. But I, the example I always like to use is I’m like, if I knit you a sweater, And you’ve never knit in your life.

You wouldn’t be like, but I didn’t knit you a sweater. And it’s just so weird how we put that pressure on ourselves for food and feeding. And I just don’t think you have to. And so just be a gracious guest, be a gracious host. And it’s not about who tit for tat or who’s doing what or who brought, what if you’re doing it for a bigger reason than just.

Getting a meal off of your list of things

[00:26:05] Nina: to do so. Yeah. It’s kind of the love, like love language thing. Like I think if you have someone over for dinner, Debra, and they. Really somebody who wants to have people over for any variety of reasons, from cooking to people in their house for whatever the reason is a nice way to reciprocate would be next time you see each other that the guest makes the plan, right?

It could be just that it’s a plan to go out a hundred percent, but it, or meet at a park or go for a walk. But it would be nice if I think that’s a worthy way, like of a tit for TA kind of thing. And I’ve talked about friendship efforts. Don’t always have to be 50 50, but it shouldn’t be a hundred zero. So if somebody had you over and went through all this effort, it would be nice.

If you then texted them sometime and said, Hey, let’s go for a walk next week. Yeah. Or, you know, let’s go out on a Saturday night or something, but you make the plan. You make the, the call. I

[00:26:50] Debra: think that’s totally it. Yeah. Cause I do think that you can, as the host, that’s like kind of maybe always doing the inviting, you can get a little, self-conscious even liking it.

Right. You know, do they even want to do this if you never hear back, but yes, it does not need to be. Now we have you for dinner,

[00:27:09] Nina: Deborah, our better friendship goal of the week is pretty obvious. It’s going to be that. I would love listeners to invite someone over and it doesn’t have to be for dinner. It could be for brunch and you and I have talked about too, that sometimes brunch is like a better entry. People are in a good mood in the morning sometimes.

I mean, not my teenagers. And again, and also this doesn’t have to be with kids at all. Uh, invite someone over even to now, this is really, isn’t really about hosting, but if you need like a baby step, what if you invite someone to go for a walk, but you start from your house and say, come over and say, hi, like I want you to come see.

Where I live, right. Have a cup of coffee and then we’ll go for a walk or something. I don’t know. Just. In the habit of you making the effort and inviting someone into your space. Yes. I want to remind everybody, you can find Deborah’s Instagram for the love of cookbooks. She goes through every single recipe, whether it is a recipe she is excited about or not, which is really cool.

And it’s just fun. And she does really good job showing the process and she makes it look. Doable. Like she’ll make things and I’m like, well, I can chop a vegetable like that, or I can saute, like I can do that. And then she makes it look possible and she has her kids helping sometimes. And by the time people hear this, it’s gonna be even bigger.

And the author of half baked harvest, what’s her name again? Tegan Gerard shared Deborah went through every recipe, sent Tegan the cookbook to be autographed and. Tegan shared it on her TikTok with a gazillion follower. So that was, so it was

[00:28:33] Debra: exciting for all of us. It was a very exciting way to start my day last week.

So,

[00:28:37] Nina: yeah. Yeah. Anyway, well, Deborah, thank you so much for being

[00:28:40] Debra: here. Thank you so much. This has just been so fun. Like I said, I’m glad that I will always be on the wall of fame of the first in person guest. And it’s so appropriate that it would be on the theme of hosting that you host me. Oh yes, that’s true.

For the first time. Um, that’s true. And. It’s so fun. I love you.

[00:28:55] Nina: So all I haven’t even offered you a glass of water. That’s true. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. And thank you listeners for being here. If you have time to rate, review the show, subscribe, that would be awesome. Thanks to Dave Luger for producing on the back end.

And remember when our friendships are going well, we are happier all around.